Date: Sat, 4 Mar 1995 04:23:08 -0500 From: Ryan L (RyanSpiral@AOL.COM) Subject: Slowdive's Pygmalion vs. 5ep Someone was asking how Pygmalion sounds as compared to the 5ep. Well, they are sort of worlds apart. The use of samplers for drums/percussion sounds and guitar/instrument loops still remains but the loops are not as obviously trancey-housey influenced. It's like they took the the trancey-housey loop concept, and stripped it down, and put a whole different kind of sound in its place. Also, for Slowdive, Pygmalion is somwhat dark, sad, and a little mysterious, as compared to their other bliss-pop work. It's also very different from their previous LP Souvlaki, which is very band oriented. Pygmalion is very non-band oriented; except for song 8, there's no song where there's real drums and bass played along with the guitars (song 1 might seem like it, but its all sampled percussion and cymbals, the bass part is also actually a synth). As for my personal opinion on this release, I think that Pygmalion is a very beautiful, sometimes sad, sometimes blissful, work of art. I don't know how to rank it against 5ep and Souvlaki, so I won't. I will say is that Pygmalion is very different from them, and is just as good, and just maybe better. Regardless, I highly recommend it, especially to those who like their previous work, seeing the evolution of their sound into such an original release as this. I have it playing here almost every day and I'm not in the least bit sick of it. In a strange way, it kinda sorta reminds me of LSD's 'Ardor', a blend of bliss, beauty, and meloncholy. Date: Thu, 11 May 1995 13:49:50 -0500 From: Jeremy L Orr (jeremy@GXL.WOODTECH.COM) Subject: Re: Slowdive EPs ---from Simon Hughes (quoting Larry Koch (who was quoting someone else (I just love parentheses within parentheses))): > > > "Slowdive" (the eponymous song, and two versions of "Avalyn") and > > > "Morningrise" are the first two EPs, and are absolutely essential > > > if you like Slowdive. The third one, "Holding Our Breath", is less > > > good. > > > All three are on the compilation "Blue Day", except for the long > > > instrumental "Avalyn 2" and "Golden Hair" from the third EP (don't > > > know why these were left off, as there is plenty of room for them). > > > > Yes - if you're going to compile non-album material, why not all of > > it? > > Erm, it's marketing isn't it? As in "Let's get `em with Blue Day and then > we'll force `em to buy the other EPs for completeness". While this does happen far too often (especially from US major labels), I've read interviews with Rachel Goswell that contradict this. She said that "Golden Hair" was left off of _Blue_Day_ because of a legal matter. Apparently, when they decided to record it for the third EP, they contacted Syd Barrett's estate directly, and they gave the approval. Then they changed their minds when they caught wind that the song was about to be re-released on the comp. Why is anyone's guess. I don't know if I believe the story, but that's the official line. And yes, "Avalyn II" was left off because it's simply an instrumental version of "Avalyn I". Incidentally, I listened to _Just_for_a_Day_ last Sunday for the first time in about a year. I used to really love that album, but having since heard _Souvlaki_ and _Pygmalion_, _JfaD_ sounds really weak in comparison. Most of the songs are pretty good, but the production is pretty bad (the same reason I prefer the first two EPs way more than the third). And pardon my ignorance, but where did the word _Pygmalion_ come from, anyway? ---Jeremy Scattered, smothered, covered, and topped. Date: Wed, 16 Aug 1995 10:11:05 -0600 From: "blueeyes.brownhair" (vonminde@RINTINTIN.COLORADO.EDU) Subject: the gladness of things....(verylong!) ....or the state of the musical world in our time. before you read this, realize that i'm not accusing anyone of anything, just trying to make a point. also realize that i am capable of rambling on overzealously without truly realizing it. yesterday, after much bitching about how boring and uninspired music is these days, lars stated that he thought that this is one of the most exciting times in music ever (although he apparently thinks that all the time). well folks, i must agree with the man. okay, it's not 1985. 4ad has a completely different vision, but there are some incredible things happening none the less. here are some releases from the last 12-15 months that are so amazing we should thank any existing higher beings that we have them.... slowdive-pygmalion, this is a masterpiece you fools, you can't tell me it's not still holding your attention (for shame!). you should listen to this and then write this little equation on the chalkboard in your head (if you haven't done so already) neil = genius. yes, he's that good. now, you should calm down and say that if neil and rachel could succeed in making 5ep and this record after making incredible swirlieguitar records then they should certainly be able to make an absolutely amazing acoustic slide guitar record......rejoice in mojave! i'm not saying i'll accept anything they do just because it's neil and rachel, but i say we start to look forward to things instead of bitching about this or that. it's time to stop mourning what is past. i don't really like the idea that 4ad is signing some mediocre acts, but that's the way it is. there is so much wonderful music out there......rejoice in what you have! Date: Mon, 28 Aug 1995 05:44:19 -0700 From: einexile the meek (einexile@NETCOM.COM) Subject: and to make up for that last note Nothing gets me truckin like a little guilt. :) Mojave - Ask Me Tomorrow ------------------------ 1. Love Songs on the Radio 2. Sarah 3. Tomorrow's Taken 4. Candle Song 3 5. You're Beautiful 6. Where Is the Love 7. After All 8. Pictures 9. Mercy It may be true that nothing can beat Pygmalion--in fact I'll give it away and confirm that fact: nothing can beat Pygmalion. But this is one hell of a country and western album. We start with the infamous track everyone wanted the new comp for, even though you all pretended you cared about Scheer and Tarnation. Love Songs on the Radio's intoxicating quality does not suffer with age from diminishing returns. It remains the closest thing to sex in a bottle this side of the 5ep, those strums carrying you along, Rachel more prominent than ever before, the bendy guitar like nothing you have ever heard before. It is bore beautiful than any Simon Bonney, Nick Cave, Red House Painters, or The Moon Seven Times (well, there are some DAMNED good M7x songs on 7=49) that come to mind. The songs lingers and lingers and then ends, and we start slowly into Sarah. Now we have piano, generous and full but not stealing the show. The percussion on this album is largely brushed snare, very nice with classy cymbals all over, the beats commanding some but not all of your attention. jOHN unfortunately will HATE this album since I am about to compare it to the brilliant DARKLANDS. Not really, but it has some of those same nice qualities. Sarah is soft and sweet and innocent and short, a sad little Neil lament, before begins Tomorrow's Taken, a fucking work of art. It is SO goddam great. Rachel again, her voice deeper, full and sexy. Rhythmic piano and more of those gorgeous bendy guitars. The harmonies come in and the song is just heaven. We are moving fast now, faster than you might expect. The singing becomes sadder, more pensive, and the song cuts off, slowing to a long epilogue with a stunning, subdued cello melody. Here as in other places on the album, we hear Neil singing near the back of the room as if was not meant to show up on the recording, or even is a ghost. The epilogue goes further and then winds down. I think this may be the best song on the album. No, this is. Candle Song 3. Gentler than the previous tracks, and a genuine duet between Neil and Rachel. Ivo Lorelei's disinterest in the harmonies on this album are, I'm sorry, DEAD WRONG. The vocal harmonies on this album blow the M7x and their rubber duck out of the bathtub. This is the best duet I can remember. We are moving slowly through this genuinely heartbreaking song with a sweet guitar melody plucking back and forth. Then the harmonies pick up, the percussion becomes more interesting, and the song goes full rhapsody. Still slow, but so rich and with such power. There is nothing like this album anywhere. Neil and Rachel are out in full force, hiding nothing. We begin You're Beautiful, just Neil with delicate, complex picking. This record has an amazing flow to it. The cello comes in. Rachel comes in. The song retains its modest tone, dipping into interludes and back out, then ends peacefully. Where Is the Love starts in another full duet, piano and strum. The songs on this album are so basic and simple, so frequently returning to the tonic, but so original and pretty and pure, traveling between sections with such confidence. The chemistry between Neil and Rachel is different here; more anguished, they resonate strangely. The effect throws you off; the song seems almost carelessly put together, but it is at the same time lively and healthy. After All has Neil almost alone again with his guitar, the piano winding behind secretively, then full instrumentation comes in, including the cello. Neil is becoming more emotional as we near the end of the album. Guitar picking drops through like a subtler Sundays moment. Rachel again accompanies him, though Neil continues to dominate the song. I feel for him on this track. He is very convincing, all the more so because he seems not only to be speaking for himself, but for us all. When he has said his piece the song vanishes. Pictures begins with another very pretty picked melodies. Some of you may be shocked but I saw it coming: Neil Halstead has turned into James Taylor! He really kind of sounds like him here. The harmonies are gorgeous on this track, the pickings tricking us to stumble into unexpected chords. This song is also unique in that he is harmonizing with himself--something he does quite beautifully and should probably do more often. The song draws to a slow close, as classy as ever, then bangs in Mercy, slow and quiet at first, but this is the make no mistake about it end of the album song, as it should be. Already it vibrates with some kind of power. It is the harder edge to the snare, perhaps. And to the strum. it is more raw. Neil sings alone and is joined by Rachel. Blammo, anthem time. Tonic, tonic, tonic. We even have some distorted guitar here. It's goddam great. It's so simple and so perfect and it just sweeps you away with it...but wait, chill, we have some business to take care of. Nice slow bits here and there. This is one heck of a little story they're hinting at. Always hinting. The power of the song is unleashed, all class and restraint but such power and passion. As perfect an ending as was the beginning. I apologize for the plodding song-by-song rundown of the album but thought as much specific information as possible might interest a lot of people as this record seems to be the source of a lot of anxiousness, as it should be. :) Trust me, you will NOT be disappointed, and if you are, then you are HOPELESS! The album comes out October 17. Sorry if the track listings annoy anyone but I like it when people post that stuff. :) Date: Sun, 21 Jan 1996 20:15:46 -0600 From: goo goo goo joob (joroses@MAIL.UTEXAS.EDU) Subject: lots of little things that add up to nothing i think slowdive is about the songs. i'm a nitpicky one about vocal stuff, it must be the two years of bullshit classical training i had, but more than the vocals what comes through is how they put the music together. the reason i like slowdive so so so much is because neil et al may start out with a simple melodic or chordal idea, but they add layers of melody, lyrics, and effects that can only complement their original idea and usually turn a merely good 'idea' or phrase into a completely mind-blowing 'song.' just as an example, with 'souvlaki space station' and 'where the sun hits,' my two favorite songs by them i must add, the band starts the song with a snippet of some melody (in the former, a simple delayed progression of notes, in the latter, two guitar phrases and one bass line) and simply repeat them. then the vox/fx/additional guitar lines gradually come in and proceed to take the top of your head off and complement the basic song idea. i can't think of one slowdive song off the top of my head that contains the overuse of effects or bludgeons a musical idea to death. i'm sure there are a few, no one can be on all of the time, but these are exceptional occurences rather than what they base their entire musical output on... ([mini-review] and the new starflyer 59, which i bought on a stupid whim, is an example of the above: they use the same tuning/mode/musical space/unimaginative lead guitar lines until half-way through the second side, you've either fallen asleep, have a headache, or have turned the damn thing off already.) as complete songworks, 'souvlaki' is their best release so far. 'pygmalion' can test your remote control trigger finger patience sometimes (and is a completely different beast from what i'm offering above...i don't think one can compare slowdive's earlier output to 'pygmalion,' if you want to debate that email me privately), and the mojave incarnation...well, i just haven't listened to the bugger enough yet to comment. Date: Tue, 30 Apr 1996 22:42:09 -0800 From: Jens Alfke (jens@MOOSEYARD.COM) Subject: Re: slowdive recommendation "Pygmalion" is the best thing Slowdive have ever done, apart from the incomparable first two EPs. The sound is very stripped down, but not at all in the same way as Mojave3, whose sound is very direct/live/acoustic; "Pygmalion"s mostly been run through lots and lots of reverb and tape echo, which almost becomes another instrument on several songs (on "Miranda" there's an eerie building noise that keeps intruding, which is the sound of an echo box feeding back.) The overall effect is very hypnotic and ambient, without the use of any keyboards or sequencers. Some people do hate it, and it's very different than the earlier Slowdive. If you require massive amounts of swooshing flanging guitar effects as on "Just For a Day" or most of "Souvlaki", you will be disappointed. __________ __________________ Jens Alfke jens@mooseyard.com Some outside and some indoors-- Oh my oh my oh dinosaurs ________________________ http://www.mooseyard.com Date: Wed, 13 May 1998 13:40:53 PDT From: Christian Hartwig Subject: Re: slowdive type thing >well, if you like the more shoegazey stuff, go for their early EPs >(s/t, morningrise, and holding our breath, or the impossible to find >Blue Day). Their last album, pygmalion is much more ambient >electronic, and is good as well. I think the inbetween releases are >the rock-sounding ones. Not that I don't like Just for a Day or >Souvlaki, but they are more "rock" oriented. I agree. Their second LP (depending on how you count, first US) _just for a day_ is good but sounds rather dated nowadays. Souvlaki is uneven but has some outstanding stuff on it, especially if you have the US imprint with with some more electronic bonus tracks (taken off of an EP I assume) foreshadowing Pygmalion. Pygmalion is excellent and a surprise after the "rock"ness of Souvlaki. It's much more spacey, sparse and atmospheric and they really seem to be in there element. Anyone on the new slowdive group mojavie 3? I haven't heard any of their stuff. >>someone once described the b.e. LP beat to me as 'slowdive with hip hop >beats' I actually find their slowdive-like songs rather annoying. They're some great songs on that LP but the slowdive "covers" aren't among them. Date: Wed, 13 May 1998 14:47:28 -0700 From: Travis Subject: Re: slowdive type thing --------------8A55E35F2C57FFA6C5CD0161 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Blue Day-Awesome!--impossible to find compilation of their first singles Just for a Day-great tunes but muddy production, sounds the most like bowery electric-available in used cd bins Souvlaki-beautiful guitar textures and there is even the credit "mixed and flanged by"--this cd seems to pop up every once in a while but only had limited american release Pygmalion-definitely their most experimental of their albums, sounds a bit like Bark Psychosis without the jazz, I've heard comparisons to Spirit of Eden by Talk Talk but have never heard that album so I can't say-availability is extremely limited as it never had an american release; it is around, just expect to pay $20-25. As you come from the electronic side of things, I would highly recommend the In Mind single. It has their slowdive sound but in ambient/techno songs. Three songs off this single, along with a cover of "Some Velvet Morning," were included on the american release of Souvlaki. I would suggest you go with Souvlaki, because it's an album that presents all their styles, and if you like that album you'll probably like them all. Travis Date: Wed, 13 May 1998 19:59:22 -0400 From: butterfly mcqueen Subject: Re: slowdive type thing -Reply >nagging slowdive question: i can understand why 'golden hair' was >omitted from 'blue day', since it's a cover. but why leave off 'avalyn 2'? i'm assuming you haven't heard the song, then. "avalyn 2" is basically "avalyn 1" without the vocals. i don't remember whether the exact same tracks were used or whether a separate instrumental version was recorded. given that the vocals in "avalyn 1" are pretty much instrumental (in that they're waaay in the background and unintelligible) anyway, the proper instrumental version isn't really essential. i'm not sure either about the slowdive/bowery electric comparisons -- i love both of them to death, but i think i recall b.e. denying them as influences. they seem more about "academic drone" (reich, young, niblock, et al) + mbv + spacemen 3 + joy division + hip-hop. but the question of influence aside -- i think anyone who likes slowdive's early sound (circa _blue day_) would love bowery electric's first s/t album and vice versa. ; e.e. Date: Wed, 13 May 1998 18:30:09 -0500 From: Jeremy L Orr Subject: Re: slowdive type thing I might as well get my two cents' in, too. ---from Christian Hartwig: > Their second LP (depending on how you count, first US) _just for > a day_ is good but sounds rather dated nowadays. _Just For a Day_ is their first album in any country, regardless of how you count. It's got one great song ("Celia's Dream"), but it's all too cleanly produced and samey-sounding. > Souvlaki is uneven but has some outstanding stuff on it... Counterpoint: I think _Souvlaki_ is their best album (too bad about that title, though); in fact, I think it's one of the best albums ever made. It's a lot more varied than its predecessor, and the production is light-years better. > ...especially if you have the US imprint with with some more > electronic bonus tracks (taken off of an EP I assume)... The bonus tracks on the US _Souvlaki_ are from the "In Mind" single, which was a UK-only release that came a few months later. I'd recommend buying the single if you're looking for more of their techno-shoegaze stuff, because for some idiotic reason, they didn't include the single's title track on _Souvlaki_, even though there was plenty of room for it. And because _Souvlaki_ is their most "rock"-sounding release, the more electronically-based bonus tracks sound incredibly out-of-place. But the single is somewhat hard to find these days, so good luck. > Pygmalion is excellent and a surprise after the "rock"ness of > Souvlaki. It's much more spacey, sparse and atmospheric and they > really seem to be in there element. Agreed...comparisons to parts of Seefeel's _Succour_ or the aforementioned _Spirit of Eden_ aren't far off the mark. > Anyone on the new slowdive group mojavie 3? I haven't heard any > of their stuff. I liked their first album well enough, but the two new songs I've heard so far - "To Whom Should I Write (demo)" from 4AD's _Anakin_ comp, and "Give What You Take" - are complete crap. Lyrics have never been Neil Halstead's strong point (although he's had his moments), but it seems that he's really lost it at this point. "Give What You Take", in particular, is a bunch of really bad cliches (musical and lyrical) badly strung together...and the fact that they're preparing to release two singles called "Who Do You Love" and "Some Kind of Angel" makes it sound as though we can expect nothing but more of the same banality in the immediate future. Date: Wed, 13 May 1998 17:44:00 -0700 From: Michael Scholtz Subject: avalyn 2 from, uh, butterfly mcqueen: >>"avalyn 2" is basically "avalyn 1" without the vocals. i don't remember whether the exact same tracks were used or whether a separate instrumental version was recorded. although it builds on the same theme, i always thought 'a2' was a thicker, spacier track which took 'a1' as its departure point. don't tell me they just cut the vocals! i'm fortunate to have the e.p., so i'll have to dig it out and play it this eve. $.02 more on slowdive: the two demos on the sunday flexi are great, the first 2 creation e.p.s were amazing (esp. the songs 'morningrise' and 'slowdive', but there isn't a weak track on any of them. yes, dammit, 'a2' is essential!), things started to get a bit too pretty for my taste on the third e.p. and 'breeze' album, and 'souvlaki' didn't live up to the early promise. but given jeremy's plug, i think i'll dust off 'souvlaki' too when i get home tonight and give it another chance. mike Date: Thu, 14 May 1998 18:48:05 -0500 From: Jeremy L Orr Subject: Re: Slowdive/Eno connection ---from the boy in zinc, quoting Igor V. Boronenkov: > > From interviews, I had an impression that Eno had quite a > > lion's share in "In Mind" production. All in all, he wanted to > > collaborate, invited Neil to the studio and asked to strum his > > guitar a bit...end of Slowdive involvement. > > i'd heard this as well, but if you look at the credits for the > american souvlaki (and i believe the credits for the in mind ep) > eno's name does not appear anywhere on it...this goes for "sing" > on souvlaki (both american and uk versions) as well. i'd heard > eno was to have contributed heavily to the in mind tracks and > sing...anyone know if this is true or merely a well-constructed > rumor? Brian Eno was reportedly approached by Slowdive as a possibly producer, but he declined, saying that he would rather collaborate with them instead. In my copy of the UK version of the _Souvlaki_ CD, Eno is credited with 'treatments and keyboards' on both "Sing" and "Here She Comes", and is given a co-writing credit for the former. Eno didn't participate in the making of the _5EP_ ("In Mind").